Sleepy Idealist

“Mariolatry”?

May 1, 2006 · 12 Comments

Was reading a old back issue of Tabletalk magazine, which is published by R.C. Sprouls organization, Ligonier Ministries. It has a decidedly Presbyterian bent, but I don't think they're explicitly affiliated with them. Anyway, this issue was from 1999 and was about the faith of the Eastern Orthodox Church. Needless to say, I was intrigued to see what flames…er, that is, comments they had.

I don't even remember what the specific article I was reading was about, but it used the word "Mariolatry". I thought it was an interesting word, and after looking it up to confirm my suspicisions, I found that it means "excessive veneration of the Virgin Mary".

Excessive veneration? Where'd that come from? Sure, we Orthodox pay Mary her due, but I'd hardly call it excessive. Maybe he meant in comparison to the Presbyterians ;)

So I'm going to open what's probably a huge can of worms and ask this question: What do y'all think about Mary? Is she anyone special, and where do you think she fits in in today's Christianity? I'll post my views later, though I bet you can guess what they are…

Categories: Orthodoxy · Religion

12 responses so far ↓

  • Whitney // May 1, 2006 at 3:40 pm

    You would try to stir up trouble, wouldn’t you?

    Well, in my opinion, Mary, although I respect her as a sister in the Lord, is not any different from the rest of us. She’s just a human and she had her faults too, so we shouldn’t believe that she is the only way that we can communicate with Christ. We also shouldn’t fall into the lie of making her more important than she really is.

    Those are just my thoughts.

  • Crystal Spirit // May 1, 2006 at 6:39 pm

    Mary is special. As she said herself, all generations will call her blessed. She, out of the entire human race, was chosen to be the Mother of our Lord. She IS the Theotokos, the God-bearer. She is the Mother of God, for Christ was fully God and fully Man, inseparable. I believe most Protestants do not give her the veneration she is due. The example she sets for us is one of humility and obedience. She was willing to be the Mother of God. She deserves our honour and praise.

  • Melodi Anne // May 1, 2006 at 6:41 pm

    Oh boy. I’d really rather not argue right now, so I’ll just hush. But I generally attend Baptist churches, so that probably tells you a lot. ;-)

    So I did decide to get a WordPress…but it’s just my writing blog, nothing else. :-)

    ~Lita/Lizzy

  • David Ketter // May 1, 2006 at 7:02 pm

    You can find MY opinion of her in my article, Purpose and Love: Mary, the Mother of Jesus.

  • Holly // May 2, 2006 at 1:10 pm

    I think that she’s a great role model, someone that I admire…but I don’t see her as being ain any way higher than other followers of Christ simply because she was chosen for the honor of being used to bring Him into this world.
    I don’t think we should pray to her, nor to other “saints,” for there is one mediator between God and men, the man Jesus Christ. “Saints” were really just men and women with hearts after God that He chose to use, just as we can be used if we allow Him to,
    I suppose I think of her in the same way I think of Esther or Ruth–women I respect and seek to emulate in their godly characteristics, but who were believers in God just like you and me

  • Bganwen, of the Female Persuasion. ;) // May 2, 2006 at 1:43 pm

    I think Mary is one of the highest of role models available to Christians today. She was worthy of being the mother of the Christ, the Savior of the world. She humbly submitted to God’s plan, even when she didn’t completely understand it and when it would often make her life harder. She was obviously a very, very Godly woman. She deserves high (if not the highest) respect and praise. But her place shouldn’t be confused with that of God Himself. I doubt that this is an error many true and understanding Catholic and Orthodox people fall into, though I do think that those churches lend the “casual churchgoer” to the liklihood of worshiping Mary on a place equal with Christ Himself.

  • Emily // May 2, 2006 at 2:32 pm

    I think Mary was a great woman, but she was just like us. She had her problems and weaknesses, just like we do. She was a normal person, who chose to give her all to obey God, something all of us should do.

  • Crystal Spirit // May 2, 2006 at 8:23 pm

    Holly said:
    I don’t think we should pray to her, nor to other “saints,” for there is one mediator between God and men, the man Jesus Christ. “Saints” were really just men and women with hearts after God that He chose to use, just as we can be used if we allow Him to,

    If that be the case, I dearly hope you do not ask friends to pray for you. After all, there is one mediator between God and men.

    Do pardon my sarcasm. But when we pray to her, or to the Saints, we are asking them to pray to God for us, just as we ask our friends to. There is no worship save to God. The only time we worship when we pray is when we pray to God. But then of course… do people really understand what “worship” is today?

  • David Ketter // May 3, 2006 at 8:20 pm

    The problem, Alessandra, is that we are also commanded not to pray to the dead. Necromancy is condemned. Those who are physically dead are not to be spoken to…CANNOT be spoken to.

  • Crystal Spirit // May 3, 2006 at 10:24 pm

    Oh, but David… Did not God say that He is the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and Jacob? And did He not also say that He is not the God of the dead, but of the living? And did not St. Paul say that we are running the race surrounded by a crowd of spectators?

    Necromancy is condemned. That is very true. Which is good for me that I don’t practice it then. ;)

    Physically dead, in body, yes. Spiritually in soul, no. They are dead in this world’s fleshly body, but they are alive in Christ. God is the God of the living, after all. And He is still their God.

  • Crystal Spirit // May 3, 2006 at 10:26 pm

    Also, David… where does its say that praying to the dead is condemned? Check out Second Maccabees, I think it is. And another thing is that necromancy is not speaking to the dead so much as conjuring them up. Which is why Sauron was a necromancer, but I am not. ;)

  • David Ketter // May 4, 2006 at 11:21 am

    First of all, you’re not going to help your case by citing writings that were not viewed as Scripture by either Athanasius, Cyril of Jerusalem, and other EASTERN Church Fathers…Cyril rejects any book outside the Tanakh and Athanasius names some that are worthy of study, but not considered Scripture (you can see my series on my blog about that…)…

    He is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, yes. But note that the Hebrews cried out to Him in their troubles – never to Abraham, Isaac, or Jacob. :)

    The verse you refer to “surrounded by a crowd of spectators” is in the Epistle to the Hebrews – the authorship of which is debatable – and the meaning of the phrase is equally ambiguous…for all we know, it could be talking about angels as well…

    They are alive in Christ, but they are “asleep” in Christ until the resurrection of the dead. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord but they are not omnipresent as He is…therefore, how shall they hear the calls of the living?

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